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Deus Ex Robo
6655321
 
Joined: 30 Jul 2008
Post Count: 1090
Comment: Is my new life a reward for the one I led?
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  Posted: Wed Jan 27, 2010 12:05 pm |
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| RoboDemise : | | The good story is used up and they will probably run the franchise into the ground. |
Good story? Used up? 
I'm pretty sure they can take/use any other good film's story or even, dare I say it, write an original one?
I think they can only go up from the first one.
Although it'll be pretty hard to think and create something more or as epic as the first film.
_________________
All of humanity is of my creation. They are all the ways I could have lived my life, but didn't. All the possibilities I missed. The reason for their existence is to give contrast to my ego.
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DoktorNo
Internal Troops Officer
Joined: 13 Jan 2007
Post Count: 933
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| Posted: Wed Jan 27, 2010 1:28 pm |
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In the worst case we can always ignore shitty sequels. 
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DoktorNo
Internal Troops Officer
Joined: 13 Jan 2007
Post Count: 933
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| Posted: Thu Feb 04, 2010 10:30 am |
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More Avatar 2 news:
http://marketsaw.blogspot.com/2010/02/exclusive-want-early-word-on-avatar-2.html
http://www.denofgeek.com/movies/408860/avatar_2_details_emerge.html
Intresting ideas, from comments there:
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There are some interesting details in the scripment, script and the film that we can build upon.
- The idea that humans have a base on one of moons is really plausible. Jim Cameron would have a chance to explore other worlds without stretching logic too much. I don't like that much the idea that the Na'vi travel outside their planet.
- Like thoso I'd love to see a new, more sinister villain, but this time not a corporation/army man but a cold, calculated scientist. A seemingly respectable silver-head who in fact is a sadistic, callous monster who lost his soul and any remains of humanity long ago. Embodiment of evil intelligence. He could be the one who initially collected samples of Na'vi DNA for the engineering of avatars (and experimented on them and flora and fauna in a secret base on Pandora). You know the type of guy who casually and indifferently would operate on a living organism without anesthetics if it helped him to get the answers he needed. He could work closely with Selfridge (or be related to him in some way - after all how come that Selfridge is the head of RDA on Pandora in such a young age? Family connections?)
- Selfridge knows what Grace told him about the biological network on Pandora, and that's the kind of info humans may use to muscle their way back. Instead of fighting with the Na'vi, they may try to kill the planet itself, so to say, by somehow "hacking into" and destroying the network. If it's dead, everything else dies, plants, animals, the people. What's left is a dead rock that can be blown up to pieces for all the unobtanium that's there.
- Jim Cameron likes playing with archetypes, and with lovers the basic one is when they get separated. So I think we could expect something similar with Jake and Neytiri. Maybe one of them gets captured by humans. If it's Neytiri we could get an interesting reversal of roles. In Avatar Jake freaked out when he got lost after the thanator chase and used his human common sense to stay alive (making the spear & the torch) which ironically almost cost him his life. I'd be interesting to see Neytiri freaking out in a human spaceship / laboratory on one of the moons and using Na'vi logic to make sense of the alien environment.
On the other hand if it was Jake who is taken prisoner we could have a classic revenge subplot - apart from Selfridge, there must be a lot of people who got really p*ssed off by what he did and just dying for the opportunity to pay him back. (besides he's the "born loser" to whom sh*t always happens )
[Edit: just had a thought - if the main new villian was a scientist then Jake is a perfect specimen to be experimented on: 1. his avatar host body wasn't originally meant for him which makes him one of a kind, 2. his consciousness was transferred by Eywa not by link so it makes him even more interesting, 3. if he went "through the eye of Eywa" his mind may have some information about Her that humans could somehow extract form him and use against the planet.]
- There is a plausible way to bring back Grace, sort of... In the script it is stated that after the unsuccessful attempt to save Grace her avatar just slept vacant. It's not dead. And since Eywa can function a little like a very unpredictable link there is a possibility that something may be awaken in Grace's avatar. It wouldn't be her, but maybe elements of her consciousness, more a medium than a real person but still.
- Then if humans are somewhere in a base on one of other moons and preparing a military landing on Pandora they might be interested in lowering Na'vi morale by playing with what they see as their primitive superstitions. I can't see why they wouldn't make an avatar that looks like Quaritch and send it on Pandora to taunt the people guerrilla style. ]
[ I was browsing through the articles on Pandorapedia, and was surprised to find that my ideal villain actually exists
I wanted:
Quote:
a new, more sinister villain, but this time not a corporation/army man but a cold, calculated scientist. A seemingly respectable silver-head who in fact is a sadistic, callous monster who lost his soul and any remains of humanity long ago. Embodiment of evil intelligence. He could be the one who initially collected samples of Na'vi DNA for the engineering of avatars (and experimented on them and flora and fauna in a secret base on Pandora). You know the type of guy who casually and indifferently would operate on a living organism without anesthetics if it helped him to get the answers he needed. ]
Now, in the article on Avatar Program, there are quite interesting lines:
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Initial dissection of Na’vi specimens found that although Na’vi show a surprising degree of external convergent evolution, internally they are quite different from humans. The Na’vi brain in particular, with its external tendrils and three-lobed structure was a daunting obstacle.
Building on work with brain-wiped primates and condemned criminals, Dr. Lovecraft was able to demonstrate that full sensory bonding could be established between human twins, human-animal hybrids that shared common DNA, and eventually human-Na’vi hybrids with common genetic blueprints.
Since Na’vi don’t use DNA or RNA to carry their genetic information, producing a ‘translation table’ that matched DNA with NVTranscriptase closely enough to allow a level of morphic resonance strong enough for communication to occur required months of computer time and multiple failed experiments, some of which caused irreparable trauma to volunteer subjects.
As if this wasn't enough it seems that RDA is more sinister that we have seen yet. There is an interesting quote in the article on Venture Star:
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Unfortunately, the cost of shipping back personnel precludes returning individuals still under contract who have medical problems that cannot be treated on Pandora, so they are euthanized there. The only exception to this policy is for high-level RDA executives.
And it seems Selfridge doesn't need to wait for help from Earth if he decides to stomp the "Na'vi rebellion":
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Universal object-manufacturing system (In-situ Stereolighography plant). This can produce large, complex objects from data describing their three-dimensional form and material composition. Using raw materials obtained on Pandora, construction and mining equipment far too large and massive to be shipped from Earth can be produced, along with any replacement parts that are needed. Smaller items such as weapons and furniture, are also created, using design data brought from Earth. Locally-designed items are made as well, or modifications of existing designs.
So in terms of the passage of time in the sequel Jake and Neytiri could have humans at their throats sooner than they expect.
I would love Cameron to go darker with the sequel and explore some of these ideas.
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DoktorNo
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Joined: 13 Jan 2007
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supes2705
L-L3
Joined: 18 Nov 2008
Post Count: 662
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| Posted: Mon Feb 08, 2010 6:22 pm |
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Avatar was good for what it was, I mean if it didnt have all the new technology and stuff, I don't think it would of made the money that it did
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DoktorNo
Internal Troops Officer
Joined: 13 Jan 2007
Post Count: 933
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| Posted: Tue Feb 09, 2010 2:45 pm |
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| supes2705 : | | Avatar was good for what it was, I mean if it didnt have all the new technology and stuff, I don't think it would of made the money that it did |
You see, I think the story itself is simple, but it has some deeper meaning. I'm convinced, that this movie is about empathy to others, growing up etc. Tree-hugging message is just an icing on a cake, not main course. 
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Deus Ex Robo
6655321
Joined: 30 Jul 2008
Post Count: 1090
Comment: Is my new life a reward for the one I led?
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| Posted: Tue Feb 09, 2010 3:20 pm |
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Come on now DoktorNo, I have to agree with Supes here.
Think of avatar without all of the revolutionary CGI and patent pending 3d camera technology, it's just a regular "joe thumb up his ass" film.
Nothing too spectacular story wise.
Not to say that Cameron isn't a great director and during the "re-imagining" of dances with wolves, he didn't direct a hand full of talented actors to create an imaginitive world and race of "people" that made you want to do ayahuasca and love nature and the spirit of Gaia.
Cameron did a great job, but he's not god here.
_________________
All of humanity is of my creation. They are all the ways I could have lived my life, but didn't. All the possibilities I missed. The reason for their existence is to give contrast to my ego.
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Archive
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Joined: 17 Nov 2001
Post Count: 6538
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| Posted: Tue Feb 09, 2010 3:31 pm |
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I would have loved for the actual story to match the visuals, but as it were i sat the whole movie knowing exactly what would happen. It was a nice story but really predictable.
I still like the movie but it would have been neat to have some twists or surprises thrown in into the mix.
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DoktorNo
Internal Troops Officer
Joined: 13 Jan 2007
Post Count: 933
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| Posted: Tue Feb 09, 2010 4:47 pm |
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| Archive : | | I still like the movie but it would have been neat to have some twists or surprises thrown in into the mix. |
You see, in my opinion the weakness of the Avatar plot is a solid, undeniable fact. But personally, I prefer calling it "efficient" - because it serves well in immersing viewer in Pandora's world, and it is not cheesy.
In other words: yes, without powerful visuals "Avatar" would suck, but Cameron had intentionally made simple ("efficient") plot to make a movie, that would push the craft of filmmaking to the higher technical level.
On the other hand: I think that scenario is more suitable for movie released in 1990's, than 2000's. A physically weak character (but augmented by technology etc.) beating up stereotypical "action-man" character of col. Quatrich would be called a "twist" at that time.
Also: search for original "Project 880" script; someone had said, that "Avatar" is like a footnotes to it.
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DoktorNo
Internal Troops Officer
Joined: 13 Jan 2007
Post Count: 933
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| Posted: Mon Feb 15, 2010 9:38 pm |
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Cameron: 'It's my most personal film':
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It was an epiphanal scene for me when I was writing the script, and when I wrote it, I actually kind of welled up myself. It’s a scene at the end where the warrior that Jake has had to prove himself to, Tsu’tey, the guy that’s ... keeping him out of the clan and the whole Na’vi experience, is dying after the battle ... Jake goes to him and he hands him the baton of leadership and says, “You have to lead the people,” as he’s dying. Very, very powerful, emotional scene and again, the rhythm — it just messed with the rhythm of the ending. It just felt like there was one dramatic beat too many.
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http://latimesblogs.latimes.com/herocomplex/2010/02/james-cameron-on-avatar-its-my-most-personal-film-.html
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DoktorNo
Internal Troops Officer
Joined: 13 Jan 2007
Post Count: 933
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DoktorNo
Internal Troops Officer
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artuditu
mio Cid
Joined: 10 Aug 2002
Post Count: 1446
Comment: Stay out of trouble!
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| Posted: Fri Mar 19, 2010 9:15 am |
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It was obvious to me watching the film that there were many abrupt ellipses, I figured there had to be at least 20 to 30 minutes of deleted scenes, though reading a bit that article it could make for an hour.
I'm not sure that's good, it can make the movie richer in presentation and events, that's good, but the film in my opinion is already unnecessarily too long in many other parts.
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DoktorNo
Internal Troops Officer
Joined: 13 Jan 2007
Post Count: 933
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| Posted: Sat Mar 20, 2010 6:58 pm |
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| artuditu : | It was obvious to me watching the film that there were many abrupt ellipses, I figured there had to be at least 20 to 30 minutes of deleted scenes, though reading a bit that article it could make for an hour.
I'm not sure that's good, it can make the movie richer in presentation and events, that's good, but the film in my opinion is already unnecessarily too long in many other parts. |
First scenes of Jake Sully life on Earth are MUST for extended edition - they give appropriate context for hero's actions and decisions.
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