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Posted: Fri Feb 03, 2012 6:42 pm Reply with quote

RoboDemise summed up the hand severing well. People compare being engulfed in fire inside a car or flipped in a car to a tripod MACHINE GUN shooting the weak spot in Robo's arm - the connection of wrist and hand

As for the scene itself, I love it. Its a great poetic rhyme to the first movie where Robo goes through the same thing - being tortured, dismembered and played with, but this time in an even more sadistic manner (splashing him with his own blood asking how it tastes)

As for that weird criticism that they didnt smash his head - there wouldnt be a movie after that. For me its as silly as saying how come no one shoots Robocop in the mouth


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Posted: Fri Feb 03, 2012 6:45 pm Reply with quote

KidGoesWild :
RoboDemise summed up the hand severing well.


Thanks! I thought so too. Laughing




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Posted: Fri Feb 03, 2012 6:49 pm Reply with quote

NOF :
Also, it shouldn't matter what type of weapon it is, his hand shouldn't get blown off that easily.


That would make the character absolutely silly and unrealistic. Its not Superman, he gets hurt by large caliber weapons. ED's automatic weapons ripped him to shreds. Tripod machine gun is such powerful weapon that can easily blow the whole top of the car in a second and rip it to shreds to the point it becomes an unrecognizable object. Theres nothing wrong with Robo's hand beiong severed on the joint while shot with such massive gun

ChAnOoD :
Itīs a nasty scene. I agree with you, about how easy seems to "cut" Roboīs hand with a gun and make him just cables and pieces.

Also, how weak he looks in that scene. Ok, he had some electric gun right in his chest, but in the first one he was shot by almost the whole Detroit PD and he still wanted to live. Here they catch him with a magnet and he does NOTHING to scape or survive to that.


??? HUGE difference here. He was being shot with bullets in the first, in here he was electrocuted and had power drained from him. Apples and oranges

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Posted: Fri Feb 03, 2012 6:54 pm Reply with quote

And everybody forgets the massive hook we was knocked down with immediately before he was magnetized. I posted it already but he would more than likely be unconscious or completely... http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=auDv6cf2PBM



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Posted: Fri Feb 03, 2012 11:09 pm Reply with quote

Agreed most people forget he is part man and has a brain, so being smacked in the head with a massive metal hook could easily give him a concussion and/or knock him out briefly.

every hero needs to be seen as being mortal, having some sort of weakness. If robocop was truely invulnerable to all types of bullets and explosives then there would be no suspense, every time he came up against a bad guy you would already know the outcome will be "robo cant be hurt, he will win"

he needs this vulnerability, it not only makes for a better movie, but its a contant reminder that under all that metal, he is still merly a man.
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Posted: Sat Feb 04, 2012 3:10 pm Reply with quote

Ah yes. This storyline from RoboCop 2 that I almost think about everyday.

I like how Hob pushes down Robo's arm so he can tie it down with chains. It's the same when Robo bobbles about in Robo1 when the rapist victim tries to hug him or something. Is it the actors forgetting Robo is a heavy machine ? Laughing

Why is Angie's electro gun unexplained ? The way it functions make it nothing else other than a "anti-RoboCop gun". What else ya gonna do with it ? Shoot it at a car and electrocute the car ? Rolling Eyes I know there's a deleted scene where Cain goes cyborg shopping at Faxx's place (that sounds odd actually) so did Faxx provide them with the trademarked anti-RoboCop gun to take out Robo ? Did at that point in time Faxx was already anti-RoboCop ?

Who threw the crane thing against Robo's head ? How did that person know how to aim it directly at Robo's head ? A little misstep and he would have beheaded a gang member with that thing Laughing

Why are the scenes littered with continuity errors ?
- Robo's hand shot of, later seen attached to the forearm
- anti-Robo taser gun claws its way into Robo's chest, damage later dissapears
- drilled off leg falls to the ground despite being chained down
- both legs attached after one is drilled off
- Hob says "you cracked it" when later on we see nothing is cracked
- Hob saying he wants to see brains (is he Hannibal Lecter?) but later on apparently he didn't get his wish
- Oil sprayed on Robo's face later dissapears
- drill marks on Robo's chest suggest they drilled him again after he was already taken apart, so what was the point ?
- Robo's helmet and gun magically disappear, two iconic items that Robo should have found in Cain's Elvis area as priced items. (perhaps so Robo can retrieve this gun and then wield TWO auto9's in the following shootout)
- What's the point of Robo's arm monitor thingy ? Are we to believe this sofisticated looking equipment already existed back in Robo1 ? They always hook up Robo to a bunch of equipment and a ton of monitors display all kinds of Robo info, what's the point of having a small monitor in his arm ?

During the dismemberment, Cain is seen taking Nuke. Are we to believe he slips into a trip and doesn't really care anymore what happens to Robo ? Speaking of, Cain seems quite distanced from this whole ordeal, it's Hob who steps on Robo's chest as the victor and declares all sorts of wishes he wants fulfilled. Cain doesn't care much does he ?

I always imagine it that Robo slips into Robo-coma after he screams and the scene changes to the police station. That way, we aren't left wondering what else happens to Robo, and you can sorta imagine the badguys being dissapointed that they "broke" RoboCop and he can't respond anymore to what else they wanted to do with him. Thus why bother scooping his eyes out or whacking his face or whatever, he won't feel it anymore. Still doesnt really explain why they atleast didn't behead him.

In Robo1 we see the technicians switch Robo on and off at whim. Why is all they do is hang dismembered Robo on two wires and stare at him all day ?

I've read the Frank Miller comic. In it, Robo fights off those cop goons from the 3rd film, what were they called, and apparently debris falls on Robo. Next thing we know is Robo hanging @ OCP being all wires and junk. Afterwards he gets repaired and gets the crazy directives. I think the director/writers for Robo2 wanted to keep the crazy directives in, but had to find another way for Robo to end up @ OCP damaged. So they came up with the scenario that we got. Although it does help in giving Cain a score against our hero, thus making the end battle when our hero prevails more satisfying, I do think it does a disservice against Robo. What writer thinks it is a good idea to have our hero, a cyborg, getting chained to a table and torn into pieces ? Isn't that a bit off the wall here ? What happened to anti-armor weapons, cornering Robo with 2 ED-209's, landmines, and what else have you.

More probably later.




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Posted: Sat Feb 04, 2012 10:39 pm Reply with quote

Maxlee :
Ah yes. This storyline from RoboCop 2 that I almost think about everyday.

I like how Hob pushes down Robo's arm so he can tie it down with chains. It's the same when Robo bobbles about in Robo1 when the rapist victim tries to hug him or something. Is it the actors forgetting Robo is a heavy machine ? Laughing


This is serious nitpicking about technical limitations. Obviously Weller isnt a robot so he will react to impacts.

Quote:
Why is Angie's electro gun unexplained ? The way it functions make it nothing else other than a "anti-RoboCop gun". What else ya gonna do with it ? Shoot it at a car and electrocute the car ? Rolling Eyes I know there's a deleted scene where Cain goes cyborg shopping at Faxx's place (that sounds odd actually) so did Faxx provide them with the trademarked anti-RoboCop gun to take out Robo ? Did at that point in time Faxx was already anti-RoboCop ?


I would hate it if it would get explained. It wouldve been as stuppid as the movies are nowadays when everything has to be laid out like in school and explained like to dummies. The explanation for the weapon and its technical details is not essential to the plot, especially in a science fiction movie involving cybernetics. Same way we dont need explanation how Robo has Murphy's voice or how does he poop or why doesnt he has his mouth covered

Going back to the gun, as you hinted yourself its something from OCP. Seeing how many cyborgs they create and how they go crazy, its no wonder for me at all they would create an anti cyborg/robot tazer gun

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Who threw the crane thing against Robo's head ?


I dont see any reason to be puzzled here. Cain had men scattered throughout the place hidden everywhere. And obviously someone was waiting to throw it at the right moment, like Hob waiting with machine gun.

Quote:
How did that person know how to aim it directly at Robo's head ?


Its a huge hook and the space was narrow, Only an idiot would miss a robocop or a person there, especially when the hook was going down to such low level

Quote:
A little misstep and he would have beheaded a gang member with that thing Laughing


He would have to duck. And not only Robos not fast but it was going down so fast no one would be able to duck it when it came so suddenly. And what misstep? Cain was strategically positioned. There was only one way to Cain, you cant go wrong here

Quote:
Why are the scenes littered with continuity errors ?
- Robo's hand shot of, later seen attached to the forearm
- anti-Robo taser gun claws its way into Robo's chest, damage later dissapears
- drilled off leg falls to the ground despite being chained down
- both legs attached after one is drilled off
- Hob says "you cracked it" when later on we see nothing is cracked
- Hob saying he wants to see brains (is he Hannibal Lecter?) but later on apparently he didn't get his wish
- Oil sprayed on Robo's face later dissapears



Again, serious nitpicking about technical/editing errors. They happen in every movie and theyre not essential to the plot. They dont have budget to reshoot some scenes and didnt have CGI to fix (trivial) technical errors, so they used what they wanted for the scene the way it was designed from an editorial standpoint

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- drill marks on Robo's chest suggest they drilled him again after he was already taken apart, so what was the point ?


Simple. Torture. Dismembering body, dancing on the body of a cop. Having fun with it, in an even more psycho way than Bodicker's gang did with Muprhy


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- What's the point of Robo's arm monitor thingy ? Are we to believe this sofisticated looking equipment already existed back in Robo1 ? They always hook up Robo to a bunch of equipment and a ton of monitors display all kinds of Robo info, what's the point of having a small monitor in his arm ?


By those questions I see youre really trying to dislike the movie and force as many faults as possible. This is a very weird question, tow which the answer is - it looked cool and underlined the idea that Robo doesnt have muscles but all sorts of cybernetic stuff in his body. Its simply a red alert monitor for technicians that shows system failure. Cmon. Its a nicely design device like the compartment for leg, both showing Robos body is full of stuff like that. It only showed that fake metal biceps has functionality in it

Quote:
During the dismemberment, Cain is seen taking Nuke. Are we to believe he slips into a trip and doesn't really care anymore what happens to Robo ? Speaking of, Cain seems quite distanced from this whole ordeal, it's Hob who steps on Robo's chest as the victor and declares all sorts of wishes he wants fulfilled. Cain doesn't care much does he ?


cain never cared much anyway. He wanted to get rid of him. It was done the moment he was hooked to the magnet. The rest was just sadistic fun he left to other. It mirrors Bodicker letting others play with "another" cop in the first one

Quote:
. Still doesnt really explain why they atleast didn't behead him.


Again, youd have no movie afterwards. As stupid as saying why no one shoots Robo in the mouth

Quote:
In Robo1 we see the technicians switch Robo on and off at whim. Why is all they do is hang dismembered Robo on two wires and stare at him all day ?


Aplles and oranges. In this case theyre leftovers of a brain that can go off anytime. He has to be kept alive by electric shocks and is on the verge of dying. They cant disconnect him since his body is a junk and the brain needs support since the fused systems from the body are damaged

Quote:
What writer thinks it is a good idea to have our hero, a cyborg, getting chained to a table and torn into pieces ?


A writer that wants to humanize the character and show a crucifixion of him for the second time, even as a powerful cyborg. A writer who wants to underline Murphys still hurting human, a writer who wants a character behind the helmet, not a walking robotic tank-man

Quote:
Isn't that a bit off the wall here ? What happened to anti-armor weapons, cornering Robo with 2 ED-209's, landmines, and what else have you.


What do you mean what happened to it? Cobra canon is reused in the movie but almost useless against Cain


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Posted: Sat Feb 04, 2012 10:45 pm Reply with quote

KidGoesWild...that is beautiful. You truly deserve that "Robo 2 Loyal" medal beneath your name. Thank you for that post that really made me re-think this scene and see it in a deeper context.
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Posted: Sat Feb 04, 2012 11:32 pm Reply with quote

I enjoy this scene for certain reasonings.

I wonder things too though. Why did Robo malfunction so bad when his hand came off? Is it cause the data spike was so important to his main systems?

How did Angie know to aim so perfectly with the electro gun?

I think Robo lost most power from being electrocuted therefore he lost his strength and his power to move a lot. He could barely stand up after shocking Angie.

It's interesting the first things the guys go for after tying him down was his legs instead of his upper body.

Also didn't someone have the original script or something with Angie shooting off Robo's face? Can someone repost that?

What I like about the comic adaptation was how sorta different it was.

Maybe even more brutal?






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Posted: Sat Feb 04, 2012 11:52 pm Reply with quote

The shooting off the hand mirrors what Bodicker did to Murphy the first time around. severed/shotoff hand isnt something to brush off, it may not leave any permanent damage (and it didnt, he forgot the hand soon after), but there will be an initial shock/pain

As for Angie aiming, well, shes fluent with guns so I dont se why wouldnt she be with this one. She was also the one shooting the gas grenade so Im guessing shes a very good shot

As for starting with his legs...well, again the reson is torture. As Joker said "dont start with the head, the victim gets all fuzzy". It was also the legs that Bodicker started with. He hit murphy with a shotgun sending him to the floor. So in short, they wanted to torture him, play with him while killing him so they started with legs first, something that wouldnt kill him. Then moved to torso and ended on the head. That for me is a great rhyme to the first story and also adds more pathos to the character who has to go through the same thing again, and its also great because most movies show robots as invincible ITEMS, yet here Robocop is shown as also being helpless sometimes and as a hurting human character in pain


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Posted: Sun Feb 05, 2012 12:43 am Reply with quote

You defend your movie well, KidGoesWild yessir But don't get me wrong here. This scene has been close to traumatising me for life. Seriously. RoboCop used to be my hero, but now whenever I see him I think about how he'd look like being cut in half...

I simply can not agree with the decision to portray the movie's hero in such a way. You can't really compare it to Murphy's killing. Back in Robo1, Murphy was our established main character, yes, and we were rooting for him, yes. But he was not yet a hero. After his transformation to RoboCop and him asskicking about, he became a hero. The opening of RoboCop 2 has him kicking ass and taking names for half an hour. That's our hero. And then this scene happens. I understand the need to humanize our character, to show him vulnerable. It's a basic movie trope actually. hero gets kicked down, hero gets better, hero defeats obstacle. But was it really necesary to have him beaten in such a way that everyone has to defend the movie by saying "the villains stop at a point because otherwise there wouldn't be a movie anymore". Isn't that just lazy scriptwriting ? That's why I was bringing up anti armor weapons and ED209's and what not. If the scriptwriter really wanted Robo damaged, there were a ton of options available which might have been better watchable and made more sense in the long term.

So yeah. I HAVE to pick the scenes apart and look for mistakes, errors and awkward scriptwriting. It's my way of dealing with this traumatising experience. I have to view the scenes as simply scenes filmed by a film crew who wanted to shoot an action movie, otherwise I'd be weeping my eyes out every night over Robo getting stripped to pieces.

Chaos One, do you also have the page showing the news broadcast where Cain tells the people "they sent their mightiest weapon, RoboCop, after us, and we sent it back in pieces", or something along those lines. It helps shed some light as to why Cain's crew didn't butcher his head into smithereens and thus ending the movie right there and then. Supposedly these comics are made from early scripts and drafts and things like Robo grabbing the robbed store owner by the neck, Robo visiting his grave, and Robo visiting Faxx's lab are in the comic, so it's safe to assume this mediabreak snippet was in the script at some point in time. Wish it was kept in, it ALMOST completes the dismemberment scenes and stops making us wonder why and how.




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Posted: Sun Feb 05, 2012 12:58 am Reply with quote

I'll tell you what, the comic doesn't look too bad. Robo seems to be showing more pain which I like because maybe Robo is a bit over confident when he goes for Cain.

The jackhammer on the face is brutal, and the final line of "Hey! I think we broke it, guys!" is sadistic.

Cain and his gang had fun.




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Posted: Sun Feb 05, 2012 1:40 am Reply with quote

Maxlee :
Y If the scriptwriter really wanted Robo damaged, there were a ton of options available which might have been better watchable


But this has been the standard set by the first movie. The world of the first 2 movies is very brutal and sadistic, and the events very graphic and disturbing.

Plus the Robocop world was never meant to be technically accurate or fully logical, its in a large part a satire. A violent, heartfelt and action packed, but still a satire



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Posted: Sun Feb 05, 2012 1:41 am Reply with quote

This one?



also, man Angie looked really really hot in the comic





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