Was Lewis in part responsible for Murphy's death?

[artuditu]

And most important, did she feel guilty about it?

I remember when I was a kid how frustrated I felt because of Lewis not being there to help Murphy. Even more when she is there, but just watching powerless, I tried to re-imagine that moment, if she had her gun she could have started shooting those bastards from the side.

But before that, the way she was knocked down by Joe was a bit stupid on her part, let's be honest, it was a dumb distraction that shouldn't had happened if she did her job well (and we know she was a great cop and everybody can make a mistake), we could say because of that she failed to her partner, Murphy, and then was not there to help him.

Also we could debate if Murphy did the best confronting two armed guys by himself, and once he shot one it was matter of time for the rest of the gang to appear. Maybe he should have killed Emil straight away, instead of trying to arrest him, and leave the place or prepare for the others to show up.

We could even argue if it was a good idea at all that Murphy and Lewis parted their ways, they were only 2 cops against 6 armed guys... Do you think that going separate ways was the best option? Yes, they had more chances to find them and they had radio to communicate, but they also had more chances to be outnumbered and outgunned as it happened to Murphy.

Anyway, all that happened, and nothing could be done to change it, but the final thing to consider is: did Lewis feel guilty about it the rest of the movie? It is not stated in an explicit manner, but could we feel it behind her character, in the subtext? We know all her help at the end of the movie could be just because of friendship and partnership, but I feel there is something more, a more personal motivation, the way she acts, when she tries to comfort Murphy but he wants to be alone, there is more motivation you can see; the easy answer would be some romantic interest, but we know that was completely discarded from the screenplay, so my guess is Lewis could feel some guilt towards Murphy's death that she needed to compensate and repair, she needs to save him because she couldn't do it in the past, and she ends up saving Robo twice, almost losing her life at the end, that loyalty and sacrifice needs a very powerful motivation behind. And even from her last line, when Clarence is dead and they have won, she feels purged, relief, as if she could die in peace because she saved Murphy, in the same steel mill, against the same murderers, as if she went back in time.

And by the way, that potential idea of guilt in Lewis could have been an interesting theme to develop in the sequels.

[Joined]

And most important, did she feel guilty about it?

I remember when I was a kid how frustrated I felt because of Lewis not being there to help Murphy. Even more when she is there, but just watching powerless, I tried to re-imagine that moment, if she had her gun she could have started shooting those bastards from the side.

But before that, the way she was knocked down by Joe was a bit stupid on her part, let's be honest, it was a dumb distraction that shouldn't had happened if she did her job well (and we know she was a great cop and everybody can make a mistake), we could say because of that she failed to her partner, Murphy, and then was not there to help him.

Also we could debate if Murphy did the best confronting two armed guys by himself, and once he shot one it was matter of time for the rest of the gang to appear. Maybe he should have killed Emil straight away, instead of trying to arrest him, and leave the place or prepare for the others to show up.

We could even argue if it was a good idea at all that Murphy and Lewis parted their ways, they were only 2 cops against 6 armed guys... Do you think that going separate ways was the best option? Yes, they had more chances to find them and they had radio to communicate, but they also had more chances to be outnumbered and outgunned as it happened to Murphy.

Anyway, all that happened, and nothing could be done to change it, but the final thing to consider is: did Lewis feel guilty about it the rest of the movie? It is not stated in an explicit manner, but could we feel it behind her character, in the subtext? We know all her help at the end of the movie could be just because of friendship and partnership, but I feel there is something more, a more personal motivation, the way she acts, when she tries to comfort Murphy but he wants to be alone, there is more motivation you can see; the easy answer would be some romantic interest, but we know that was completely discarded from the screenplay, so my guess is Lewis could feel some guilt towards Murphy's death that she needed to compensate and repair, she needs to save him because she couldn't do it in the past, and she ends up saving Robo twice, almost losing her life at the end, that loyalty and sacrifice needs a very powerful motivation behind. And even from her last line, when Clarence is dead and they have won, she feels purged, relief, as if she could die in peace because she saved Murphy, in the same steel mill, against the same murderers, as if she went back in time.

And by the way, that potential idea of guilt in Lewis could have been an interesting theme to develop in the sequels.

[Post Count]

And most important, did she feel guilty about it?

I remember when I was a kid how frustrated I felt because of Lewis not being there to help Murphy. Even more when she is there, but just watching powerless, I tried to re-imagine that moment, if she had her gun she could have started shooting those bastards from the side.

But before that, the way she was knocked down by Joe was a bit stupid on her part, let's be honest, it was a dumb distraction that shouldn't had happened if she did her job well (and we know she was a great cop and everybody can make a mistake), we could say because of that she failed to her partner, Murphy, and then was not there to help him.

Also we could debate if Murphy did the best confronting two armed guys by himself, and once he shot one it was matter of time for the rest of the gang to appear. Maybe he should have killed Emil straight away, instead of trying to arrest him, and leave the place or prepare for the others to show up.

We could even argue if it was a good idea at all that Murphy and Lewis parted their ways, they were only 2 cops against 6 armed guys... Do you think that going separate ways was the best option? Yes, they had more chances to find them and they had radio to communicate, but they also had more chances to be outnumbered and outgunned as it happened to Murphy.

Anyway, all that happened, and nothing could be done to change it, but the final thing to consider is: did Lewis feel guilty about it the rest of the movie? It is not stated in an explicit manner, but could we feel it behind her character, in the subtext? We know all her help at the end of the movie could be just because of friendship and partnership, but I feel there is something more, a more personal motivation, the way she acts, when she tries to comfort Murphy but he wants to be alone, there is more motivation you can see; the easy answer would be some romantic interest, but we know that was completely discarded from the screenplay, so my guess is Lewis could feel some guilt towards Murphy's death that she needed to compensate and repair, she needs to save him because she couldn't do it in the past, and she ends up saving Robo twice, almost losing her life at the end, that loyalty and sacrifice needs a very powerful motivation behind. And even from her last line, when Clarence is dead and they have won, she feels purged, relief, as if she could die in peace because she saved Murphy, in the same steel mill, against the same murderers, as if she went back in time.

And by the way, that potential idea of guilt in Lewis could have been an interesting theme to develop in the sequels.

[Comment]

And most important, did she feel guilty about it?

I remember when I was a kid how frustrated I felt because of Lewis not being there to help Murphy. Even more when she is there, but just watching powerless, I tried to re-imagine that moment, if she had her gun she could have started shooting those bastards from the side.

But before that, the way she was knocked down by Joe was a bit stupid on her part, let's be honest, it was a dumb distraction that shouldn't had happened if she did her job well (and we know she was a great cop and everybody can make a mistake), we could say because of that she failed to her partner, Murphy, and then was not there to help him.

Also we could debate if Murphy did the best confronting two armed guys by himself, and once he shot one it was matter of time for the rest of the gang to appear. Maybe he should have killed Emil straight away, instead of trying to arrest him, and leave the place or prepare for the others to show up.

We could even argue if it was a good idea at all that Murphy and Lewis parted their ways, they were only 2 cops against 6 armed guys... Do you think that going separate ways was the best option? Yes, they had more chances to find them and they had radio to communicate, but they also had more chances to be outnumbered and outgunned as it happened to Murphy.

Anyway, all that happened, and nothing could be done to change it, but the final thing to consider is: did Lewis feel guilty about it the rest of the movie? It is not stated in an explicit manner, but could we feel it behind her character, in the subtext? We know all her help at the end of the movie could be just because of friendship and partnership, but I feel there is something more, a more personal motivation, the way she acts, when she tries to comfort Murphy but he wants to be alone, there is more motivation you can see; the easy answer would be some romantic interest, but we know that was completely discarded from the screenplay, so my guess is Lewis could feel some guilt towards Murphy's death that she needed to compensate and repair, she needs to save him because she couldn't do it in the past, and she ends up saving Robo twice, almost losing her life at the end, that loyalty and sacrifice needs a very powerful motivation behind. And even from her last line, when Clarence is dead and they have won, she feels purged, relief, as if she could die in peace because she saved Murphy, in the same steel mill, against the same murderers, as if she went back in time.

And by the way, that potential idea of guilt in Lewis could have been an interesting theme to develop in the sequels.

[Stan The Man]

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[artuditu]

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[Slash Man]

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[RoboPimp]

I seem to remember having this conversation here a few years ago, and what it ultimately boiled down to is Lewis could've just resisted looking at Joe's dick Murphy would have lived, but Murphy was ultimately responsible for his own death for being willing to go in without backup in the first place.

[Joined]

I seem to remember having this conversation here a few years ago, and what it ultimately boiled down to is Lewis could've just resisted looking at Joe's dick Murphy would have lived, but Murphy was ultimately responsible for his own death for being willing to go in without backup in the first place.

[Post Count]

I seem to remember having this conversation here a few years ago, and what it ultimately boiled down to is Lewis could've just resisted looking at Joe's dick Murphy would have lived, but Murphy was ultimately responsible for his own death for being willing to go in without backup in the first place.

[Comment]

I seem to remember having this conversation here a few years ago, and what it ultimately boiled down to is Lewis could've just resisted looking at Joe's dick Murphy would have lived, but Murphy was ultimately responsible for his own death for being willing to go in without backup in the first place.

[Stan The Man]

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[Edd 209]

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[AceAlive1]

OCP was responsible for murphy's death.

they called about backup....they didnt get any.

putting yourself in danger earlier during that chase would tell them to call it off for the time being when your life is in danger. you wait for back up after that.

[Joined]

OCP was responsible for murphy's death.

they called about backup....they didnt get any.

putting yourself in danger earlier during that chase would tell them to call it off for the time being when your life is in danger. you wait for back up after that.

[Post Count]

OCP was responsible for murphy's death.

they called about backup....they didnt get any.

putting yourself in danger earlier during that chase would tell them to call it off for the time being when your life is in danger. you wait for back up after that.

[Comment]

OCP was responsible for murphy's death.

they called about backup....they didnt get any.

putting yourself in danger earlier during that chase would tell them to call it off for the time being when your life is in danger. you wait for back up after that.

[Stan The Man]

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[Edd 209]

I'd go one step further back...

If I was following a mini van which back doors flung open to reveal half a dozen crazy men firing shot guns at me, I'd hand brake turn it and bugger off!
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Roobocop // The future of Australian justice...

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I'd go one step further back...

If I was following a mini van which back doors flung open to reveal half a dozen crazy men firing shot guns at me, I'd hand brake turn it and bugger off!
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Roobocop // The future of Australian justice...

[Post Count]

I'd go one step further back...

If I was following a mini van which back doors flung open to reveal half a dozen crazy men firing shot guns at me, I'd hand brake turn it and bugger off!
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Roobocop // The future of Australian justice...

[Comment]

I'd go one step further back...

If I was following a mini van which back doors flung open to reveal half a dozen crazy men firing shot guns at me, I'd hand brake turn it and bugger off!
_________________
Roobocop // The future of Australian justice...

[RoboLewis]

I always thought it was mainly because they both went in without backup and looking down at Joe made it worse. How many guys could they actually arrest and put in the back of their squad car? Guilt caused Lewis to go after Murphy to tell him his name, rescue him when being shot at, and helping him at the Steel Mill to get revenge. I often wondered if she had nightmares or had to see the shrink to deal with it. She sees him laying there shot to bits, touches him and a chunk of flesh falls off. (Always grossed me out and then she puts her hands to her face when she cries!) If Lewis did go to Murphy's funeral, I would've hated to explain to his widow what happened that day if she asked why she wasn't close enough to assist him.

[Joined]

I always thought it was mainly because they both went in without backup and looking down at Joe made it worse. How many guys could they actually arrest and put in the back of their squad car? Guilt caused Lewis to go after Murphy to tell him his name, rescue him when being shot at, and helping him at the Steel Mill to get revenge. I often wondered if she had nightmares or had to see the shrink to deal with it. She sees him laying there shot to bits, touches him and a chunk of flesh falls off. (Always grossed me out and then she puts her hands to her face when she cries!) If Lewis did go to Murphy's funeral, I would've hated to explain to his widow what happened that day if she asked why she wasn't close enough to assist him.

[Post Count]

I always thought it was mainly because they both went in without backup and looking down at Joe made it worse. How many guys could they actually arrest and put in the back of their squad car? Guilt caused Lewis to go after Murphy to tell him his name, rescue him when being shot at, and helping him at the Steel Mill to get revenge. I often wondered if she had nightmares or had to see the shrink to deal with it. She sees him laying there shot to bits, touches him and a chunk of flesh falls off. (Always grossed me out and then she puts her hands to her face when she cries!) If Lewis did go to Murphy's funeral, I would've hated to explain to his widow what happened that day if she asked why she wasn't close enough to assist him.

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[RoboJOF]

I think that it wouldn't be fair for Lewis to bear the blame for Murphy's death. Sure, it was her call to go in without backup, but as we learned earlier in the movie, backup is not something Detroit police can count on. Yes, Lewis did not "stay in touch" like Murphy said, almost as though he anticipated this raid going down bad, but I think its one of many instances of Murphy's excellence as an officer. He trusts his partner and will go to into the fray with her.
The distraction scene with Joe is weird. First of all, Lewis casually pops her bubblegum as if to say, "gotcha," like a pro, but then she gets so easily distracted by him. She also must have been real close to be in range of that backhander, a rookie mistake. Getting knocked out for a half hour didn't help either. She makes her way to the other side of the killing room just in time to see Murphy get blown apart. If you ask me, that would have been punishment enough.

It just occurs to me that this two officer raid is somewhat like a "Wild West Showdown." There is something iconic about the good versus the evil relying only on their wits and skill to win the day. The only problem for our heroes is that Clarence's gang fights dirty. Which is why Lewis should not be to blame. Clarence is one bad dude. There's no surrender with this guy and he hates cops. I think that had it not been for the sheer brutality of Murphy's murder, Clarence's gang would not have been able to terrorize good guys and innocents throughout the movie (when we first see them, they are squabbling amongst themselves in Emil's van, and you don't get the impression that they are really as bad as they are unsuccessful bank robbers). It's also the reason that RoboCop had to take them out one at a time to get revenge (and yes, at that point, he was Murphy and he was seeking revenge. He didn't get any error messages (Directive 3: Uphold the Law?). He must have tuned them out). RoboREVENGE!

[Joined]

I think that it wouldn't be fair for Lewis to bear the blame for Murphy's death. Sure, it was her call to go in without backup, but as we learned earlier in the movie, backup is not something Detroit police can count on. Yes, Lewis did not "stay in touch" like Murphy said, almost as though he anticipated this raid going down bad, but I think its one of many instances of Murphy's excellence as an officer. He trusts his partner and will go to into the fray with her.
The distraction scene with Joe is weird. First of all, Lewis casually pops her bubblegum as if to say, "gotcha," like a pro, but then she gets so easily distracted by him. She also must have been real close to be in range of that backhander, a rookie mistake. Getting knocked out for a half hour didn't help either. She makes her way to the other side of the killing room just in time to see Murphy get blown apart. If you ask me, that would have been punishment enough.

It just occurs to me that this two officer raid is somewhat like a "Wild West Showdown." There is something iconic about the good versus the evil relying only on their wits and skill to win the day. The only problem for our heroes is that Clarence's gang fights dirty. Which is why Lewis should not be to blame. Clarence is one bad dude. There's no surrender with this guy and he hates cops. I think that had it not been for the sheer brutality of Murphy's murder, Clarence's gang would not have been able to terrorize good guys and innocents throughout the movie (when we first see them, they are squabbling amongst themselves in Emil's van, and you don't get the impression that they are really as bad as they are unsuccessful bank robbers). It's also the reason that RoboCop had to take them out one at a time to get revenge (and yes, at that point, he was Murphy and he was seeking revenge. He didn't get any error messages (Directive 3: Uphold the Law?). He must have tuned them out). RoboREVENGE!

[Post Count]

I think that it wouldn't be fair for Lewis to bear the blame for Murphy's death. Sure, it was her call to go in without backup, but as we learned earlier in the movie, backup is not something Detroit police can count on. Yes, Lewis did not "stay in touch" like Murphy said, almost as though he anticipated this raid going down bad, but I think its one of many instances of Murphy's excellence as an officer. He trusts his partner and will go to into the fray with her.
The distraction scene with Joe is weird. First of all, Lewis casually pops her bubblegum as if to say, "gotcha," like a pro, but then she gets so easily distracted by him. She also must have been real close to be in range of that backhander, a rookie mistake. Getting knocked out for a half hour didn't help either. She makes her way to the other side of the killing room just in time to see Murphy get blown apart. If you ask me, that would have been punishment enough.

It just occurs to me that this two officer raid is somewhat like a "Wild West Showdown." There is something iconic about the good versus the evil relying only on their wits and skill to win the day. The only problem for our heroes is that Clarence's gang fights dirty. Which is why Lewis should not be to blame. Clarence is one bad dude. There's no surrender with this guy and he hates cops. I think that had it not been for the sheer brutality of Murphy's murder, Clarence's gang would not have been able to terrorize good guys and innocents throughout the movie (when we first see them, they are squabbling amongst themselves in Emil's van, and you don't get the impression that they are really as bad as they are unsuccessful bank robbers). It's also the reason that RoboCop had to take them out one at a time to get revenge (and yes, at that point, he was Murphy and he was seeking revenge. He didn't get any error messages (Directive 3: Uphold the Law?). He must have tuned them out). RoboREVENGE!

[Comment]

I think that it wouldn't be fair for Lewis to bear the blame for Murphy's death. Sure, it was her call to go in without backup, but as we learned earlier in the movie, backup is not something Detroit police can count on. Yes, Lewis did not "stay in touch" like Murphy said, almost as though he anticipated this raid going down bad, but I think its one of many instances of Murphy's excellence as an officer. He trusts his partner and will go to into the fray with her.
The distraction scene with Joe is weird. First of all, Lewis casually pops her bubblegum as if to say, "gotcha," like a pro, but then she gets so easily distracted by him. She also must have been real close to be in range of that backhander, a rookie mistake. Getting knocked out for a half hour didn't help either. She makes her way to the other side of the killing room just in time to see Murphy get blown apart. If you ask me, that would have been punishment enough.

It just occurs to me that this two officer raid is somewhat like a "Wild West Showdown." There is something iconic about the good versus the evil relying only on their wits and skill to win the day. The only problem for our heroes is that Clarence's gang fights dirty. Which is why Lewis should not be to blame. Clarence is one bad dude. There's no surrender with this guy and he hates cops. I think that had it not been for the sheer brutality of Murphy's murder, Clarence's gang would not have been able to terrorize good guys and innocents throughout the movie (when we first see them, they are squabbling amongst themselves in Emil's van, and you don't get the impression that they are really as bad as they are unsuccessful bank robbers). It's also the reason that RoboCop had to take them out one at a time to get revenge (and yes, at that point, he was Murphy and he was seeking revenge. He didn't get any error messages (Directive 3: Uphold the Law?). He must have tuned them out). RoboREVENGE!

[RoboWags]

I'd have to say yes. She made the call to go in without backup. On the other hand, Murphy should have called for her BEFORE confronting any members of the gang. His choice to make a solo arrest without his partner there to keep an eye on his back contributed to his death. However, given the nature and brutality of this particular group of felons, it's likely that they both would have been killed anyway. She was just lucky that the fall didn't kill her as Joe thought it did.
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[Joined]

I'd have to say yes. She made the call to go in without backup. On the other hand, Murphy should have called for her BEFORE confronting any members of the gang. His choice to make a solo arrest without his partner there to keep an eye on his back contributed to his death. However, given the nature and brutality of this particular group of felons, it's likely that they both would have been killed anyway. She was just lucky that the fall didn't kill her as Joe thought it did.
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[Post Count]

I'd have to say yes. She made the call to go in without backup. On the other hand, Murphy should have called for her BEFORE confronting any members of the gang. His choice to make a solo arrest without his partner there to keep an eye on his back contributed to his death. However, given the nature and brutality of this particular group of felons, it's likely that they both would have been killed anyway. She was just lucky that the fall didn't kill her as Joe thought it did.
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[Comment]

I'd have to say yes. She made the call to go in without backup. On the other hand, Murphy should have called for her BEFORE confronting any members of the gang. His choice to make a solo arrest without his partner there to keep an eye on his back contributed to his death. However, given the nature and brutality of this particular group of felons, it's likely that they both would have been killed anyway. She was just lucky that the fall didn't kill her as Joe thought it did.
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