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KidGoesWild
L-L3
 
Joined: 27 Oct 2009
Post Count: 663
Comment: I type it, you think it
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  Posted: Thu Nov 24, 2016 1:55 am |
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So I stumbled upon a vintage 1991 Box Office magazine with a lenghty interview with James cameron who was promoting T2 at the time, and he did briefly share his thoughts on the first two Robo pictures when discussing violence in movies
"RoboCop 2 is off scale as far as Im concerned. That's a disgusting film. The first RoboCop is violent but at least it's a well made film. RoboCop 2 is a pile of dog shit"
Thats the actual quote when the subject spun off about the violence in movies. So...ouch! I always knew he probably hated it. He had a big issue with Rob Reiner after Reiner presented kids with a gun in Stand By Me, and he said he made sure John Connor does not use a weapon in T2 because he finds it morally appalling to show a child with gun. Naturally, the Hob character mustve really disgusted him
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http://robocopmovies.blogspot.com/
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Joined: 17 Nov 2001
Post Count: 6533
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| Posted: Thu Nov 24, 2016 8:42 am |
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That is.... amazing!
Is it possible to get a scan or a photo of the page/quote?
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HOB888
O-L5
Joined: 17 May 2012
Post Count: 141
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KidGoesWild
L-L3
Joined: 27 Oct 2009
Post Count: 663
Comment: I type it, you think it
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artuditu
mio Cid
Joined: 10 Aug 2002
Post Count: 1446
Comment: Stay out of trouble!
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| Posted: Thu Nov 24, 2016 3:00 pm |
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Indeed, it is interesting to have a direct opinion, even if very short, from Cameron. He could have perceived Robo negatively as a kind of rip-off of Terminator, his baby, yet as a crafty filmmaker he accepts it was a well-made film (that is, good!).
R2 opinion is harsh, but I understand it if he focus only on the violence. In the last years I think a consensus has emerged among us fans that R2 tone is kind of mean and icy overall, very different from the fun and indulgent satire of R1.
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Edd 209
C-L1
Joined: 24 Jan 2008
Post Count: 1015
Comment: EMU 209 // We have the future Down Under control...
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| Posted: Fri Nov 25, 2016 5:42 am |
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Brilliant - nice find.
It was quite interesting to begin reading about his thoughts on society and violence too...
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 Roobocop // The future of Australian justice...
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JimWantsAliens
L-L1*
Joined: 10 Feb 2014
Post Count: 400
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| Posted: Fri Nov 25, 2016 11:07 pm |
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Nice find! Cameron was similarly pissed at David Fincher's Alien 3.
Hearing about how RoboCop 2 was being heavily re-written on set reminds me of the stories about Alien 3, which started filming before they even knew which storyline they were going to follow.
I like RoboCop 2 and Alien 3 but they are hard to like. They deliver on the action front, RoboCop 2 even delivers on comedy, but they both lack heart or any warmth. RoboCop 1 isn't swimming in warmth, but it does have the Home sequence which people often call the heart of the movie, and I think without that, it would a different movie.
Likewise, Aliens is balls-to-the-wall action but it has Ripley and Newt at the center of it.
RoboCop 2 starts like, 'You think you're getting any human Murphy? Guess again.' Alien 3 starts like, 'So you want to see how Newt and Hicks are doing? They're dead already.'
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ChAnOoD
DC-L4
Joined: 29 Dec 2008
Post Count: 2763
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| Posted: Sat Nov 26, 2016 10:57 am |
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I kinda agree with him. While I wouldnīt call R2 a "pile of dogshit", I think thereīs nothing wrong to say itīs "disgusting". Again, things we talked over and over, but the tone of R2 isnīt the same of the original.
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HOB888
O-L5
Joined: 17 May 2012
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KidGoesWild
L-L3
Joined: 27 Oct 2009
Post Count: 663
Comment: I type it, you think it
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| Posted: Sat Nov 26, 2016 8:59 pm |
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| HOB888 : | Cameron ? the guy who praised Terminator Genysis ?  |
To be fair he was in an awkward situation. It was his buddy's (hoped for) comeback, these guys were really nice to him, they showed him the movie and recorded him on the spot. It wouldve been kinda dick to slam the movie in front of people who were so gracious to you and record you commenting on it
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http://robocopmovies.blogspot.com/
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Stan The Man
Bah Concepts Division
Joined: 05 Jun 2003
Post Count: 7020
Comment: I'm the guy in Old Archive.
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| Posted: Sat Nov 26, 2016 10:36 pm |
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| KidGoesWild : | | HOB888 : | | Cameron ? the guy who praised Terminator Genysis ? |
To be fair he was in an awkward situation. It was his buddy's (hoped for) comeback, these guys were really nice to him, they showed him the movie and recorded him on the spot. It wouldve been kinda dick to slam the movie in front of people who were so gracious to you and record you commenting on it. |
Indeed it is fair to point that out - Shit, there was a tad of that here for a brief minute in regards to PD right when (and immediately before) it came out - Granted in short order that would mostly change, but still, on the spot, gotta be a bit more diplomatic, perhaps. I get it.
As far as Cameron's comments to R2 - As someone who still likes and enjoys the movie, I find them a bit overly harsh, but I unfortunately have few real arguments against. Especially on that particular aspect as artu noted. I agree, it is a hard film to like - It is a mean, cold, and nasty film, with little to redeem it, unlike R1 which has a lot going for it and isn't nearly as nasty or cold (I agree calling it 'warm' is perhaps going to far, but there is some warmth and emotion in R1 for sure, can't really say that so much about R2). I appreciate the complimentary remark towards R1 and think he hit it saying it is a well-made film. The same of which cannot be said for R2.
I do think perhaps there's a bit of a slant here though ('opposition' aside) as T2 indeed isn't a massively 'violent' film as is R1/R2 and indeed T1 are/were. That said, I considerably disagree with the 'if nobody isn't getting killed, it isn't violent', as that's rather disingenuous and silly, but that's me. But again, I agree T2 is very much an action film, but not seriously violent. Meanwhile R1 really didn't have a lot of 'action' in it (I think this was discussed/noted somewhere), while R2 does have a fair bit of action, maybe even to the point of being problematic.. Bah.
His comments about violence in society/etc in regards to violent film I'm glad to see - I'd like to think he'd still feel the same after all this time but I rather doubt it. He is right though, violent films hardly make violent people - it's always a fair deal deeper and more complicated than that.
All-told this a nice find and great share, many thanks, KGW.
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I don't wanna pay that, PhotoBucket. Now maybe you haven't heard, but I'm the guy in old Archive. So hows about you just shit snow for a year and I'll figure out something else. Sayonara!
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RoboPimp
PIMPY SUPREME
Joined: 10 Mar 2007
Post Count: 3124
Comment: "You dead wrong if ya think that pimpin' gon' die" - Snoop Dogg, P.I.M.P. (Remix)
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| Posted: Sun Nov 27, 2016 5:34 am |
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That's hilarious. I think that also shows why I love Robocop much more than Terminator. The Terminator series is about showing the hope left in humanity. Robocop just shows us that humanity is fucked.
Look at the end of Robocop 2, for example. A whirlwind of corruption and violence sweeps across Detroit and Robocop has to clean it up single-handedly. Then, at the end, when the debris is being swept up we see that the Old Man and OCP remain unscathed and that the violence and corruption will continue. Does Robocop give an inspirational speech to cheer us up? Nope, he drops a cynically deadpan joke: "we're only human"
Meanwhile, this is the wikipedia description of the end of Terminator 2: Sarah looks to the future with hope, musing that "if a machine ... can learn the value of human life, maybe we can too."
A little heavy-handed if you ask me. I prefer the subtler ending to Robocop. So suck on that, Cameron!
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Spectrum Scarlet
Sgt-L1*
SIMPY 4 PIMPY
Joined: 16 Dec 2008
Post Count: 154
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| Posted: Tue Nov 29, 2016 1:11 am |
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Jim Cameron. Ever the contradictionist. I know that's not a word, but I like it! 
R2 was well-made, production-wise. Kershner's camerawork, the stunts, etc. Stellar. The direction it was taken in, story-wise, was flawed. But it still made for a damn good shoot 'em up. The emotional scenes (what few there were) were wonderfully handled.
Cameron was on George Lucas' planet at that point of wanting to take over the world. He may've had a outstanding career, but his ego was ugly. If only he'd experienced a flop. Might've humbled him.
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artuditu
mio Cid
Joined: 10 Aug 2002
Post Count: 1446
Comment: Stay out of trouble!
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| Posted: Tue Nov 29, 2016 12:24 pm |
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| Spectrum Scarlet : | | Cameron was on George Lucas' planet at that point of wanting to take over the world. He may've had a outstanding career, but his ego was ugly. If only he'd experienced a flop. Might've humbled him. |
Actually, just before T2, 'The Abyss' was kind of a flop, not a huge one ($90m worldwide), but very disappointing considering what at the time was a huge budget ($70m), they probably lost some money. I don't think that affected much his ego though 
| Spectrum Scarlet : | | R2 was well-made, production-wise. Kershner's camerawork, the stunts, etc. Stellar. The direction it was taken in, story-wise, was flawed. But it still made for a damn good shoot 'em up. The emotional scenes (what few there were) were wonderfully handled. |
I agree his opinion on R2 is very harsh, I still consider it a mixed-to-good film, flawed with many interesting things. I find best and worst things of R2 are in the story though, while I wouldn't include camerawork and direction among its top virtues, not saying they're bad but compared to R1 it's just playing another league. R2 is kind of safe and conservative visual style (except perhaps in the final Cain vs Robo showdown, FX/stop-motion feast), while R1 is full of dynamic, gripping and visionary shots and editing, not just in the action/FX bits.
I can see why Cameron would define R1 as a well made film and R2 as a pile of dog shit, it's an extreme opinion with no room for gray areas, but reflects the idea of two movies just playing separate leagues.
Also, from a promotional point of view, since he was at that moment selling a long-awaited sequel, I think he is just putting distance between T2 and R2 (which was released recently).
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James Cameron talks RoboCop and RoboCop 2
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